rinseandrep said 9 years, 2 months ago:

Regarding a man being against an abortion:
Isn’t the right of abortion of unwanted pregnancies something that puts women in the same position of privilege that men have, not having to deal with getting pregnant, though?
Maybe as science gets to a point where we will be able to transfer a fetus into a device or a surrogate mother, thus being able to carry the pregnancy, the laws will adapt.

Regarding a man having to pay child support:
One doesn’t have to have sex, it’s a risk you are fully aware and accept from the beginning.

Anti-FeministFrank said 9 years, 2 months ago:

“Isn’t the right of abortion of unwanted pregnancies something that puts women in the same position of privilege that men have, not having to deal with getting pregnant, though?”
Someone has to get pregnant. Not saying it’s easy and it doesn’t mean men are “privileged” because they can’t get pregnant.
If a woman has sex and gets pregnant unintentionally she can choose not to become a mother through adoption and abortion
If a man has sex and gets a girl pregnant unintentionally he has no choice but to become a father unless the woman decides to have an abortion or adopt it out.
Can we accept that adults have sex without wanting kids and that sometimes accidents happen? And that when something does happen the man gets no say at all in whether he becomes a father or not.

Anti-FeministFrank said 9 years, 2 months ago:

oh no, you’ve misunderstood me.
I don’t want to force anyone to get an abortion!
I want the man to able to relinquish his rights and responsibilities as a father if the child is unplanned and unwanted. No rights to custody of the child, no financial or paternal responsibilities. Then its up to the mother to decide whether she still wants the child.

Evergreen said 9 years, 2 months ago:

I’m going to be naughty and play devil’s advocate here.

Ultimately, If a woman becomes pregnant and the future father of child does desires her to have an abortion, he has no say in the matter unless the woman is willing to consider.

If the woman wanted to, she could go and have an abortion without the man’s consent over the matter. It’s her choice entirely and that’s definitely not ever going to change.

I don’t know about the U.S and other countries but here in the UK, if the mother has an illegitimate child (Child who’s parents aren’t married at the time of birth) then sole custody rights go to the mother full stop, by law. The father cannot do a thing if he wants custody. However, if they are married at time of birth and the child is legitimate then the father can try and gain legal sole custody of the child.

Even if the father has good income, is a home owner and the mother isn’t working, isn’t a home owner etc. The child automatically goes to the mother if they weren’t married. It’s as simple as that.

In this day and age mothers tend to have sole custody of the child either because parents weren’t married or the father doesn’t desire to look after the child 100% or simply cannot afford to.

Rather off topic but as a matter of fact, females have many privileges and advantages in modern society that males necessarily don’t have. This is just one tiny example.

Kestrel said 9 years, 2 months ago:

(((((I have to start by saying “antifeministfrank” is really rubbing me the wrong way.
Anti-feminist. Are you anti-civil rights? Because it’s the same thing.
Americans deserve equal rights: jobs with the same pay, laws applied to everyone unilaterally, the right to vote, taxation with representation, etc. No?
It’s become popular to say that you’re against feminism because women want MORE than men. No, those aren’t feminist women, those are man-haters.
Feminists think EVERYBODY deserves the same rights. That’s all. You’re not demanding extra or more, you’re simply saying that there’s no difference in quality of people. Right? That’s feminism. To be anti-feminist is to claim that you do NOT believe both genders deserve the same laws, should receive the same police protection, freedoms, taxes, voting abilities, healthcare rights…))))

So….that’s your question.
A woman gets pregnant when a man impregnates her. If that man does not want a baby, categorically refuses to be a father, then or ever, he must take precautions into his own hands. He should demand to use a condom or get a vasectomy. He cannot hold someone else responsible for his own healthcare, right? Just as SHE cannot expect him to be responsible for providing the condom, pulling out, etc. Yes, he should but she – if she truly doesn’t want a baby – must take charge and protect herself.
If a baby results then the man has to forgo his rights. While his opinion matters, he cannot force her to have the baby. Why? Because it isn’t always that easy. I had gestational diabetes and my last boy was 11 pounds. I was told not to have more kids. A friend of mine had a child with cystic fibrosis. What if a woman was carrying your child and might have a baby that wasn’t perfect and healthy? Would you want to raise a baby by yourself that had those issues – or worse? Do you have the right to force a woman to jeopardize her own health to carry that baby? What about a still born – do you sue her? Did she fail?
If the woman chooses to carry the baby he doesn’t want, you’d be setting a dangerous example by saying he is exempt from support. EVERY guy would say he was conned into it and he shouldn’t be forced to pay up. In order to ensure you don’t have a baby, take precautions, if you do grt her pregnant, the penalty is a baby that you 2 have to deal with. Marriage, abortion, adoption, whatever. Don’t want it, don’t make it.
To me, the best thing you can push for is male oral contraception.
Here’s an interesting thought. Besides a baby, you can leave someone with other things…herpes, HIV and the like. Should you be able to sue to for that?
(Me: yes)

rinseandrep said 9 years, 2 months ago:

“Feminism is trying to solve gender inequality by solely focusing on the issues of women”

That’s not true though, see for example:

https://medium.com/message/sexytime-gender-roles-and-credit-where-due-d68a2ff36bb7

Feminism, by making the weight of providing for a family something that falls on two people rather than one, alleviates the pressure on the man to not fail his family, and the author of the article suggests that it has an effect on suicide rates of males.
Not to mention the fight for the right itself to get an abortion.

I suppose the reactions you mention are related to the context problem that the response to “domestic violence is bad” is not “some men experience it too”, it should be “Yes, it’s bad and we will say something to the men and women involved”, be it the buddy who hits his wife or the buddy who is hit by his wife.

Anti-FeministFrank said 9 years, 2 months ago:

“(“But men have disadvantages too!” – yup but not to the extent of women, not generally, there will always be exceptions but the exceptions make the rule.)”

It’s all too easy to push men’s issues out of the way because women’s issues and issues affecting women are seen as being more important. Whether this is a genetic trait to protect the only people who can reproduce or a social construct, im not sure, but it does exist.
People in general care about the wellbeing of women as a whole far more than they care about men as a whole and this is reflected numerous times throughout history and today. Women get easier jobs, closer to home, with less hours and with very little personal risk to themselves (93% of workplace deaths are male).
Women get access to many, many women only scholarships and assistance even though it’s a fact that girls outperform boys in every single level of education all over the world.
Battered women’s shelters are very prevalent even though at least 40-50% of domestic abuse victims are male. But men don’t really get hurt by domestic violence do they? They are big and tough and really what can a woman do to hurt him?
We have a culture that writes laws that doesn’t accept that a male that is forced to have sex IS rape. Yes, women might be asked what she was wearing or why she decided to walk through that particular street, but will she be asked if she actually wanted it and enjoyed it because she got aroused?

Men aren’t seen as victims ever, any time they are its because “people” are the victims. If 13 people get shot in a shoot-out, a news article will almost always point out that 4 of them were women as though its somehow a bigger injustice to shoot a woman than it is a man. The guys? nah, they are just people, nothing special about them.
Sorry, rant over. There are issues that affect EVERYONE and it pisses me off that feminists can just trample over the men’s half of the issue and then claim its a “women’s issue” and that they, the women, need special help.

The sooner we stop treating women like they are fragile and weak the better because they most certainly aren’t.